Waves of Irritation

Wow so it's already Wednesday.

This keeps happening.

I feel a little tongue tied, again, because of the landlord situation. At the legally mandated 30 days after occupation he sent along a bill from his contractor for $500 more than our security deposit.

I assume, though I can't be sure, this is what he's calling an itemized list of damages we owe him for. Though maybe he was just forwarding his contractor's bill to us for fun?

From what I understand from the law we were owed more than a contractor's bill for a bunch of jobs without a cost for each item. Luckily after talking to a lawyer, he agreed. So we're on to the next step of trying to get our money back from the clutches of a man who is so "smart", when we let him know about the massive ice dams forming at his roof line (warning him of potential damage to his property, because you know we cared for his property), he responded, and I quote,

"Folks, we've talked about this before! You have to shovel the snow away from the foundation of the house."

Here's a tutorial: "What are ice dams?"

He's so lovably dim-witted. There's really nothing better than a dim-witted, wealthy, bully. A charming combination.

Anyway I'm sending a (certified) letter today explaining his failure to provide us an itemized list of the damages he is claiming we are responsible for. He has 14 days to respond, maybe he will! Maybe he'll even respond after 4 days! Maybe I'll start talking on the phone and love it so much I become a phone sex operator! (Read: Never.)

He probably won't respond so we'll end up going to small claims court. Where a judge will look at these pictures and wonder how it is that the entire house needs to be repainted and the cabinets are filthy.

I'm wondering the same thing myself.

Comments

That's just wrong! And if you make it to small claims court, chances are good that the judge won't even give him the time of day if he hasn't done everything by the book. That was our experience. Good luck!

[sarah]

In NYC it is the landlord's responsibility to repaint when a lease turns over or is not renewed. For some reason I thought this was standard around the country, you might want to check that out.

Sorry you're dealing with this. Nothing like trailing shit-headedness to ruin an otherwise good week.

[Meg]

Wait, I thought you spent the last week of your lease re-painting the house.

[Pandora]

There's no federal statutes for repainting. Jeeze.

It looks clean, certainly, but there is one photo of a bedroom(?) wall with a large lighter patch in the center. Do you have photos from the time you moved in?

[Jenn Bo]

After looking through the photos, I cannot figure out what damage you created for repair. This place is spotless! No carpet to replace, wood floors do not appear to need refinishing, and there was no cleaning required (unless perhaps someone wanted to splash around a little pine sol aroma). The only things that might not be "visible" would be working order of appliances (and why would you be responsible for that wear and tear) and structural damage (exterior/interior and why would you be responsible for damages created by the weather). Speaking of ice dams and basement flooding that could supposedly be resolved by shoveling, was there anything in your contract stating you agreed to maintain the exterior in certain ways? I've seen contracts that specify yard care such as mowing the lawn, but nothing about removing ice dams or shoveling snow.
Good luck! I hope you have a sensible small claims court because it seems your headed that way.

[kate]

Not to be dense, but these are photos you took after moving out?

The place is immaculate! He is obviously trying to get you guys to pay for work he wants done.

You were so, so smart to take photos; he doesn't know who he's messin' with! Does he know you took these pictures? That knowledge would, I would think, save you all the trouble of going to court and him making an even bigger ass of himself...

[Lisa]

I had a landlord like this once. He claimed he had to call in a cleaning service after we left because the (crappy, plastic) mini-blinds were dirty. The law only required that the house be "broom-swept" not immaculate. When we tried to bring witnesses into the house to see the condition at walk-through he refused to allow us in. We should have sued him for our deposit but never did because, although we knew that we could win (we were all law students at the time) we knew that we would never get the money from him. None of us had the time or money to try to enforce a small claims court judgment against him. Getting the judgment would be the easy part, but getting the money would have been impossible. I hope that you get a judgment against him and then file a lien against the property so he won't be able to see it without paying you first!

What an asshole.

[Lisa]

That should read "sell it" not "see it"

Sorry.

[jfoo]

What a prick.

I wish you would come and do some "damage" at my house. I just rented out my flat yesterday and I hope to GAWD that they are as conscience as you.

take care.

[Joy]

I'm love the comment that Xiobhan wrote on the Flicker page about hoping the next tenants are frat boys that have a tendency for tagging.

This is such a crappy thing to have to go through. All I can say is keep up the good fight. Don't give into this guys greed! And I'll say a few prayers for the frat boys. Or maybe just a family who's the opposite of ya'll and completely the worst tenant a landlord could get. You know the one that drops acid and decides that the wall is talking to them in the middle of the night and it needs to be beaten with a sledge hammer. ( My sister had a tenant that did that! )

[Angela]

You could caption most of these pictures LOLcat style, "Invisible damage!" The only damage I see is stuff that looks like it was caused by the flooding that you informed him of.

[Sarah @ BecomingSarah.com]

I think, although I'm not positive, that California law states that if renters have occupied a property for over three years (or something like that) then it is the landlord's responsibility to re-paint. You might want to look into that sort of thing in your state; here, the tenant doesn't have to foot the bill unless the paint was severely damaged and the time the tenant occupied the building is less than the three years (or something like that).

[James]

I think I speak for everyone on the block... WTF. Big Bee has lost his last marble and his baseball. I think I saw him with a helmet on bouncing off trees recently. He is now asking $1,950 a month for it in the listing on line. What a turd.

[Alyce]

He has got some balls to claim that there is any damage, let alone $2500 worth. Nice try, a**hole.

[Lisa]

This guy sounds like a real tool. I can't imagine what could have required $2500 worth of work! Ridiculous!

[Angie]

There's ALWAYS the prick who thinks he's "Sooo smart". I hate those people.

You'll win this one, for sure, there's no damage in that house.

Good luck!

[beyond]

agh! this must be so irritating.
it sounds like you're taking it in stride, well done.

[Janine]

OMG! You sound so calm. I would be totally losing it. I'm sure it will work out in your favor. This guy is a total idiot.

BTW, loved seeing you on GMA!

[Gretchen]

Man, if that is $2500 worth of damage, then I, as a renter, am effed! We rented a brand new house, never lived in. I was just noticing yesterday wear and tear from us being there one year. Obviously it is not going to look "brand new" when we move out someday, I hope the landlord doesn't expect it to be that way either....

[April]

I think I commented this before (but I can't see more than 3 or 4 comments per entry for some reason. No scroll, no nothin'. But whatever.) but I swear we've got the same landlord.

All the douche-y emails were the same, he's a total jerk and we are currently in small claims mediation over our missing security deposit.

If they aren't the same, but they sure are both assholes.

If that lawyer works out well, I might just need to be emailed their contact info.

[Alyce]

Hang in there! We had a similar situation when we moved out of a rental a year ago. We did end up going the small claims route - if Michigan does arbitration - that's the way to go. We didn't get our whole deposit back, but we got about 70% and all it took was a small fee, half an hour of paperwork and two tedious hours with an arbitrator. Totally worth it! I did manage to resist telling our former landlady to suck it on the way out of the court house. Barely.

[Jen]

I'd definitely go with a letterhead letter from the lawyer stating that you've got pictures and copies of correspondence and that he should hand over the money, plus interest and maybe some more for your trouble, NOW.

Way back when, in college in Massachusetts, four of us signed a lease for the next fall and the landlord decided to "cancel" it a few weeks later. Happily, my brother had been renting out his condo and knew the rules -- in MA if they screw with you, it's *triple* damages, as in they'd owe you three times your deposit.

One of the roommates had a local lawyer uncle who wrote a letter to him for us, on letterhead, demanding our deposit back doubled, for the honor of our not taking him to court for triple.

And much to our parents' amazement, the check came the next week. A very, very proud moment.

[amy]

Good for you guys for taking pictures, smart people. This guy does not stand a chance.

I hope his next renters are worse than frat boys! I hope they are marijuana grow operators. Yeah, THAT would really destroy the house. :)

[Nan]

Omg, he's full of it. He probably doesn't have the money so he's trying to squirm out of it. He probably got a friend of his to make up a phony bill. This reminds of a landlord we once had -- after he and his wife got divorced I ran into her and she told me he was such an uptight a** to us about the deposit (going in and leaving) because he was flat broke. Fight him on this -- get your money back!

[Lisa Dreishmire]

Melissa, you are probably all over this as indicated by your post, but in case you haven't seen it, this handbook is quite, well, handy regarding what to do about the security deposit in MI:

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/Publications/tenantlandlord.pdf

Note the 7-day deadline to contest.

[darcy]

You should have done something evil like leaving a dead fish in the crawl space or something...I mean you saw the writing on the wall a long time ago, he was going to go after you for something...
I live in North Idaho though, things are less "lawyerly" here, we sometimes have to settle things with the dead fish.

[Kelly]

Maybe he'll be speared by an icicle as he "shovels the snow away from the foundation." WHAT?!

Someone get Judge Judy on the phone, pronto!

[andrea from the fishbowl]

Argh! So maddening. How on earth are you keeping it together? I would have been a crumpled heap over this weeks ago. It sounds like you're doing all the right things. Stay tough!

[Krys]

Melissa - If only you'd been our renters. Just some key words so you can imagine the apt after they left: ferrets, drugs, stopped-up-toilet, robbing downstairs neighbor, grease --- ugh, I shiver just at the memory...
That house is immaculate.
As a former landlord, I prayed every night for decent tenants. (Never got 'em, btw, but I prayed hard!)
Wish you were them! (They?)

[joe elliott]

We prefer to rent, and when we decide to move from a place, we don't pay the last month. we send a letter saying the security deposit (which is equal to a month's rent) will be that last rent and if there are any issues about the state of the place (like you, Melissa, we leave the place better than we found it) they can contact us. We've never been contacted, and they are always willing to give a good reference to the next landlord. We have, however, been burned each and every time we paid "properly" and waited for our security deposit back. Each time the "charges" were trumped up. The last time this happened the landlord claimed he needed to repaint an entire room (which cost the entire $900.00 deposit) because there was a "pencil mark" by a light switch. Couldn't he have erased it, if there even was such a mark? Does it really cost $900 to paint a room "renter's beige"? After that, never again.

[Melissa Summers]

We tried to withold the last month of rent....he started legal proceedings.

[Ally]

Melissa, For the love of all that's good, please please please please please please please please please please please please please please come over and clean my house. I will give you snacks.

[Why Mom Drinks Rum]

Ooo, the effer! I HATE THAT!

You know what, if you have a lawyer who you've done a bunch of work with (or who does things for free with booby-flashes) have him send a letter. Quote a bunch of laws.....working for a law firm (and having been screwed over by landlords in the past) I know this works about half the time.

I hope he FALLS INTO A GIANT PIT OF ROTTING ENTRAILS! Or...sprains his ankle.

[dewshane]

Good for you for taking all of those lovely pictures upon your departure...that's thinking ahead. I can't believe what a complete and utter turd this guy is. He is so CLEARLY out to fuck you guys over. Lemme guess...was he really nice when you first moved in? Because he was hoping you'd buy the house. And now he's being a dick because you left and he's still stuck paying the mortgage. I hope he has to pay your deposit back and then some for all of your troubles!

[carosgram]

Obviously he didn't know you took dated pictures! Can you get him for harassment or malicious persecution? I hope not only that you get your money back but also some kind of penalty payment from landlord. Thinking of you and wishing you the best

[Tim]

Just to throw my two cents into the pile. Many years ago I was a "frat boy" renting a house. When the lease was up we left the house in good condition, but not great. Our dog had dug some holes over the year in the backyard that were somewhat smoothed over, paint was chipped, carpet was... well, quite frankly the carpet was quite beer stained, despite us renting a steam cleaner in the hopes of getting some of our security deposit back.

Long story short, we move out and I didn't expect to see a dime of the security deposit. But thirty days goes by and there's no itemized accounting of where the security deposit was spent (This is in CA). So I do the research on the laws, photo copy a few pages and draft up a letter. I get one of my friend's dad who is an attorney to let me use stationary from his office and mail the letter, a couple days later I get a panic sounding voicemail - they are refunding the security deposit in full - check is already in the mail, no need to get an attorney involved. And sure enough it showed up the next day.

My advice on this is you find the laws supporting your position, photo copy them, highlight them, and send them to the landlord (on lawyer stationary if possible). If he knows he's got a good shot of losing in court he may just cut his loses and hand over the cash.

[norm]

Hmm, you know, this could amount to criminal fraud, too.

[Dawn]

Were you renting from one of my ex-inlaws? That sounds like their kind of "smart."

Sue the bastard!

[Maureen]

I'm so sorry there are a-holes like this out there that make life miserable for the rest of us. And I'm sorry you have to deal with this. I've been very lucky to have rented from non-miserable people -- one sweet old man I rented from was so apologetic that he had to take $30 out of my deposit when I moved out for cleaning. We had lived there for quite a while and I wasn't expecting a dime. Bless his heart. I hope you get everything back and then some.

[Maureen]

Oh, wait, I forgot that my husband and I, in our youth, rented from a crackhead -- we didn't know it at the time. We feared for our lives and had to move out in the middle of the night and we didn't get a dime back. In fact, he stole my husband's identity. It was a year process of clearing up my husband's credit. I've tried to block that crackhead from my brain.

[Vanessa]

I just moved, and the place I left wasn't anywhere near as clean as yours, even though I nearly killed myself mopping and sweeping and vacuuming before I turned in the keys.

I think your landlord is on crack.

[Finn Reeds]

I'm so sorry you are having this hassle. Many years ago I had to take my former landlord to small claims in Ferndale...she was so stupid she wasn't even licensed to rent in the city, so I was immediately awarded double damages. Please check into that for your landlord and I will cross my fingers that you get the same easy outcome.

[spoiledonlychild]

To me, this is the biggest argument for buying instead of renting. Forget the whole investment/tax issue. When you rent, someone else controls a huge important thing in your life. They can raise your rent whenever they want, they can force you to move out, they can refuse to do important repairs. Not wanting an asshole landlord to have control over my life was the reason I bought a house.

[Megan]

Wow! Having spent 30 days and $5000.00 cleaning up after S#!t bag renters.....you can rent from us anytime your interested in moving to the Seattle area....

[Cara]

I had a landlord once that didn't return my $1000 deposit and tried to charge me for painting the dark wood kitchen cabinets white and the 70's paneling in the living room. Apparently, he thought it was my responsibility to pay for the house to be updated. I took him to small claims court and won almost $3000 from the settlement. Texas law says that if you win, you are awarded 3 times the damages (the deposit). I was a happy camper.

[Catherine]

OMG. You should completely punish this person by going on Judge Judy.

I would pay to watch this...

[Kelly]

http://www.tenant.net/Other_Areas/Michigan/p1/security.html

If he doesn't get you that list in 45 days, it is not only yours, but you are due DOUBLE.

Also, cleaning can not be claimed. Perhaps the rental market is not the best place for him.

[MelissaSinGA]

While looking ice dams up on Wikipedia here's what I found

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_dam#On_roofs_of_buildings